guest:MIYAMOTO Amon Miyamoto Amon was born on the Ginza. From his earliest years he has seen Yurakucho as his home turf, and he keeps in touch with the changes transforming the heart of Tokyo. Now his eye is on the Tokyo International Forum. His host, Kisaragi Koharu, belongs to almost the same generation. Their perspectives include both Asia and the whole world, but for them Tokyo is always the center where it all comes together. Both are also highly aware of change within themselves, and their interests and thinking overlap on many dimensions.

Exhibition Holl

A theater district-why not a festival site?

　You lead a double life, commuting back and forth between Tokyo and Okinawa. Why Okinawa?

I've just moved to Okinawa, to the south of the main island. It's a place where legends of the southern islands are still told, where there are also relicts of the battle for Okinawa, 52 years ago. When you put these two things togeter, you have a place that's long been a pivot point of history, where the spirits of the earth live on. To me, that's very exciting. I was born by the Shinbashi Theater, just five minutes from here. Now this Tokyo boy has encountered a wholly alien soil (laughs).

When I was a child, what I dreamed of was musicals and other Western things. In the past ten years, I have also begun to work on the stage. Now I want to totally rethink myself. First, I want to look where I plant my feet, to look at Japan objectively. Then, I may be able to rediscover myself. And then I might come to like Japan, in a completely different sense. At least that's the way I've been thinking. Still, why Okinawa? Because Okinawa has been part of Japan…and not part of Japan. From a cultural perspective, it's not a part of Japan. It's the crossroads of Asia.

　 It's not that I am pursuing some special field. I just find excitement in trying something new. In my case, if I don't have that stimulation, I can't create. That's my bankrupt character, I suppose (laughs).

"It's a light hearted, urban space. It's a place to relax and meet people." MIYAMOTO Amon was born in Tokyo in 1958. As a director, he has been involved in musicals, operas and dramas. He has also frequently been a host on TV and radio programs. Okinawa and the cinema are his current interests.

　Frankly, I love this building. When it was completed, I was stunned. I talked with an architect friend about its good and bad points, and for about three months, I was a real Tokyo International Forum freak and hardly talked about anything else.

　Why I like this space so much is very specific: it's that Tokyo has never had this new kind of space before. It's a structure that suggests playful uses of space. The design is bold, not afraid to be unique, and the sculptures casually placed here and there fit. There's a lot of "wasted"space, used by being not used. It's a real pleasure to see this relaxed use of space in the middle of the city.

I hope so. This building is fun; you can see the pleasure on visitor's faces. Since I'm eager for change in Japan, I hope the Forum does become a symbol of the Marunouchi and Tokyo as a whole.

Let me say again, then, that what I look for are changes in exterior, interior, and in management, too. A fixed, expressionless face won't do. The ways in which people express themselves change from year to year. This space, too, should change. And when the face changes, its personality changes, providing reasons for all sorts of people to gather here. A New Image for Theaters Let me say again, then, that what I look for are changes in exterior, interior, and in management, too. A fixed, expressionless face won't do. The ways in which people express themselves change from year to year. This space, too, should change. And when the face changes, its personality changes, providing reasons for all sorts of people to gather here.

"If we construe the idea of a theater district broadly, our plants and opportunities increase." KISARAGI Koharu is a playwright, director, an agent for the theater troupe NOISE. Born in Tokyo in 1956, she participates frequently in theater workshops, is a writer and a speaker-a very busy person indeed. She is actively involved with other women of the theater in Asia and other parts of the world.

A New Image for Theaters

　Today, you and I went to see Hall D. It's an interesting space for experimental productions, a place that young people full of crative energy will feel free to use as they like.

I've been in the audience many times in Hall C. I really like the way the entrance is lighted, with lights set in the floor. The members of the audience do look a little embarrassed as they walk in, but for a moment, everyone gets to feel like the star of the show. It's a way of acknowledging the importance of the audience, and here, too, we see a playful heart atwork.

That's an important idea. In the building as whole as well as in Hall C we can see the designer's intention. If there are people who don't like it, they should do what you just said and propose something new. Personally, I hate mediocre design and performances that don't arouse either complaints or enthusiasm (laughs).

I do have a few small complaints (laughs). Overall, it's a bit too stiff and ceremonious. That could use improvement. It is important, I know, to discuss the survival or extinction of the human race, but…(laughs) I'd also like it to be a space where, in the broadest possible sense, playful hearts can exercise themselves to the full. And the lobbies are too small! (laughs). Here are the guests who have just become the stars of the show and out they go into that cramped space. We shouldn't be thinking of the theaters one by one. If we consider the building as a whole, there's lots of space to use. It ought to be inviting the audience into all that space. The placement of the cafe's ought to be rethought, too.

On Broadway, guests go out onto the street during the intervals. Wineglasses in hand, they chat with each other. That's the kind of space the Tokyo International Forum should be. We need to bring that used but unused space to life.

If we think of it as a thater district, the facination will be in having the four halls compete with each other. Then, when the crowds from the different halls mingle, the scene will become even livelier.

The whole building should be used as a space for festivals. Suppose, for example, we staged a big event for which "architecture"was the key word…We wouldn't just have people talking about buildings and technologies. We'd have music related to architecture…theater related to architecture…there could also be a bazaar, food stalls, street musicians…All sorts of people could mingle here, guests with a wide variety of interests. Unexpected things could happen. The Forum would become a place for collaborations. It would draw attention to new types of architecture. Of course, architecture is just an example; any key word will do.

Japan is backward, in that respect, I think. If we cast our eyes around the world, we find all sorts of instances in which people of different types are working together to get something new and better going. I wish more people knew about these kinds of collaboration.

And not just artists. Ordinary people and people from other countries should also get involved.

I'm not just relaxing either (laughs). Besides producing a movie, I am always questioning myself. Are theater and film utterly necessary for people? Or are they unnecessary? Why am I involved with them? It's because I want to provide an opportunity for communication, for emotional experiences.

The setting is Okinawa during the Vietnam War, so it has social significance-but it's not one of those heavy, fraught films. I'm trying to create images that show the energy and humor of Okinawa's people, and I hope the audience gains some energy from it. In that respect, I'm like you.

Everyone involved says it's a strange movie. Still, being a producer and a film director are really totally different roles. I'm learning as first as I can so that I won't make any bad faux pas in dealing with film people.

Yes, putting a mental "finished"stamp on whatever you're seeing is fatal. A playful heart is a heart that is always interested in what is going on, a heart that's full of questions. By examining different perspectives, you can always make new discoveries, make things more interesting. If it's lively and absorbing, then an elegant kind of power emerges.

If we could have a series of unique festivals here, Tokyo would become a more interesting place. With so much information coming together…Tokyo's future starts here.